Bush's cabinet?

[allpro]

Why are so many appointies from Bush's cabinet resigning?

[LT Mick]

Because they see that he is a lying back stabbing SOB

[SouthsideLadderMan]

Colin Powell and John Ashcroft took their jobs with the Mutual Understanding of the President that they would only be serving one term.

Condi Rice will make an excellent Secretary of State and the New Attorney General is also a good choice.

We need someone to confirm the Judges that the President appoints. These Senators and Congressman cannot continue to try and Legislate from the Judicial Bench. It seems as though when a Conservative President attempts to appoint a Conservative Judge, it get's stymied by Liberal Congressman.

The reasoning behind this is simple, if you cannot get your Liberal Bills and Laws legislated the old fashioned way, you get a Liberal Judge (Bader-Ginsburg, Day-O' Connor) to legislate from the bench. Judicial Appointments are the last ray of hope for Desparate Liberals. And WTF is up with these Hyphenated Women? Are they not prouf of their Marriages so they feel the need to let everyone know their Maiden name as well????

[SouthsideLadderMan]

Because they see that he is a lying back stabbing SOB


I see yet another John Kerry Kool-Aid Drinker missed his morning Medications.

[LT Mick]

I see yet another John Kerry Kool-Aid Drinker missed his morning Medications.
Just another bleeding heart liberal Democrat here!

[Emtmom]

At least 4 of the 6 that are leaving announced it before the elections even took place. Bush knew before the election that if he returned to office he would be replacing a good part of the cabinet members.

[allpro]

"Colin Powell and John Ashcroft took their jobs with the Mutual Understanding of the President that they would only be serving one term."
What about the others?

"Condi Rice will make an excellent Secretary of State..."

Why wasn't she appointed to that position during the first term?

[TaskForce]

Colin Powell and John Ashcroft took their jobs with the Mutual Understanding of the President that they would only be serving one term.

Condi Rice will make an excellent Secretary of State and the New Attorney General is also a good choice.

We need someone to confirm the Judges that the President appoints. These Senators and Congressman cannot continue to try and Legislate from the Judicial Bench. It seems as though when a Conservative President attempts to appoint a Conservative Judge, it get's stymied by Liberal Congressman.

The reasoning behind this is simple, if you cannot get your Liberal Bills and Laws legislated the old fashioned way, you get a Liberal Judge (Bader-Ginsburg, Day-O' Connor) to legislate from the bench. Judicial Appointments are the last ray of hope for Desparate Liberals. And WTF is up with these Hyphenated Women? Are they not prouf of their Marriages so they feel the need to let everyone know their Maiden name as well????

Chris and I have differing political views, but this actually isn't abnormal...I think Clinton replaced like 7 Secretaries after the first term...

[SouthsideLadderMan]

No, she was National Security Advisor.

[hog]

At least 4 of the 6 that are leaving announced it before the elections even took place. Bush knew before the election that if he returned to office he would be replacing a good part of the cabinet members.good fact mom.........now we have to stick together ....................
but some Kerry wackos have to keep this shit going instead of standing behind the President of the United States

[allpro]

"...but some Kerry wackos have to keep this shit going instead of standing behind the President of the United States"

What?

[hog]

"...but some Kerry wackos have to keep this shit going instead of standing behind the President of the United States"

What?
it means that some Kerry wackos won`t support the President ......i say love this country or get the hell out

[allpro]

I'm no supporter of Kerry nor do I care for Bush's policies, but that does not make less loyal or patriotic to my country. Even Colin Powell was against envading Iraq initially.

[hog]

did you vote allpro?

[Emtmom]

I'm no supporter of Kerry nor do I care for Bush's policies, but that does not make less loyal or patriotic to my country. Even Colin Powell was against envading Iraq initially.
Yes he was, he told Bush to wait until Jan. 2005. Told Bush the timing was not right, and he should wait.

[medic5]

I heard Bush's cabinets were made of wood. :D har har

[LT Mick]

it means that some Kerry wackos won`t support the President ......i say love this country or get the hell out

You can still love this country and still disagree with the Pres. I do not know if you were around in the 60's & 70's but we learned this from Viet Nam. Disention is what makes this country what it is. Bush lied to us about Iraq, plain & simple.

[Emtmom]

You can still love this country and still disagree with the Pres. I do not know if you were around in the 60's & 70's but we learned this from Viet Nam. Disention is what makes this country what it is. Bush lied to us about Iraq, plain & simple.
Thank You! I totally agree with you, I get so tired of people telling me that I can't support our troops, because I don't think Bush is the man for the job. I can support our troops and love my country and still not agree with our leader. That is what this country was founded on, being able to believe what we want and say what we think!

[LT Mick]

Are these your eyeballs? I found them in my cleavage.!!!!
Yes nd they are very happy too :D

[hog]

You can still love this country and still disagree with the Pres. I do not know if you were around in the 60's & 70's but we learned this from Viet Nam. Disention is what makes this country what it is. Bush lied to us about Iraq, plain & simple.
Bush did not lie....intellegence told him that ....and my personel opinion if you think Hussain didn`t have them weapons you are blind....the bastard killed his own people.......to blame Bush for lieing is stupid.....and by the way it takes more than a president to go to war..................so i would like to say that us as a country should get behind our president and troops and knock the bullshit off....i served in the Persian Gulf it is a hotbed for terrorist just like the ones Hussain was training

[Emtmom]

Bush knew the intelligence was wrong and he admitted that after we had invaded Iraq. So YES, he did lie! Don't you find it strange that Powell wanted him to wait, told him going in when we did was a bad idea. MAYBE, because they knew the intelligence reports were FLAWED!

[hog]

no he didn`t lie......how can you say he knew that it was wrong?........democrates......get over it

[Emtmom]

no he didn`t lie......how can you say he knew that it was wrong?........democrates......get over itYes hon, he did! and for the 50 millionth time I am a registered independent!

[hog]

you are Kerry lover....lol.........answer this is the world safer because Hussain is out of power?

[Emtmom]

you are Kerry lover....lol.........answer this is the world safer because Hussain is out of power?I'd like to at least say the people of Iraq are safer, but with all the terrorists moving into the country that's not even true!

[LT Mick]

you are Kerry lover....lol.........answer this is the world safer because Hussain is out of power?

In Iraq, maybe! The rest of the world is more dangerous. I support our troops, they are doing their jobs, and doing what their commander has ordered them to do.

Bush and his cronies lied to the american public, and to the rest of the world.

Why in the hell have we become the world police?

We are also becoming the bullies the Soviet Union used to be.
They wanted to spread communism around the world, by force if necessary. Now we are going to spread democracy around the world because we say it is the right way. Even if the rest of the world does not want it!!!!!!!!!!

Is it really good democracy to force a country to be the way WE say they should!!!!

[Vollies Suck]

IMHO, we had no right and no legitimate reason to invade Iraq. True conservatives do not initiate war against other nations, and while I hope we win this one decisively, I think it was a very bad decision. Bush deserved to lose the election over this issue.

BUT...Bush was a far better candidate than Kerry, whose left-wing views and record scared a lot of people. (Yes, I held my nose and voted for Bush.) Had the Democrats nominated a more moderate candidate, I think Bush would have lost.

Nobody could argue that the people of Iraq are safer today...Saddam was a brutal dictator, but at least the Iraqis could go to work, or shop, or live their lives without fear of being blown up by terrorists. Between the US armed forces and the terrorists and insurgents, Iraq is now an extremely dangerous place for anybody to be.

Regarding the original theme of this thread, I think four years of low-paid, high-stress, 24/7/365 service in a Presidential cabinet is enough for anybody. God bless Colin Powell and the others for their service to our country.

[turbojet]

Before you get all hot and bothered over cabinet resignations, please remember that Clinton lost 7 cabinet members between his terms. This is just another case of the mainstream liberal media making something out of nothing, and getting the tree hugging liberals all up in arms.

[Emtmom]

IMHO, we had no right and no legitimate reason to invade Iraq. True conservatives do not initiate war against other nations, and while I hope we win this one decisively, I think it was a very bad decision. Bush deserved to lose the election over this issue.

BUT...Bush was a far better candidate than Kerry, whose left-wing views and record scared a lot of people. (Yes, I held my nose and voted for Bush.) Had the Democrats nominated a more moderate candidate, I think Bush would have lost.

Nobody could argue that the people of Iraq are safer today...Saddam was a brutal dictator, but at least the Iraqis could go to work, or shop, or live their lives without fear of being blown up by terrorists. Between the US armed forces and the terrorists and insurgents, Iraq is now an extremely dangerous place for anybody to be.

Regarding the original theme of this thread, I think four years of low-paid, high-stress, 24/7/365 service in a Presidential cabinet is enough for anybody. God bless Colin Powell and the others for their service to our country.You're right, hell has frozen over, I actually agree with you! LOL

[Emtmom]

Before you get all hot and bothered over cabinet resignations, please remember that Clinton lost 7 cabinet members between his terms. This is just another case of the mainstream liberal media making something out of nothing, and getting the tree hugging liberals all up in arms.Turbo, we were'nt hot and botherd over the cabinet thing, it's when Bush and his war got into the mix that people started getting hot and bothered. A good debate is always a good thing!

[hog]

IMHO, we had no right and no legitimate reason to invade Iraq. True conservatives do not initiate war against other nations, and while I hope we win this one decisively, I think it was a very bad decision. Bush deserved to lose the election over this issue.

BUT...Bush was a far better candidate than Kerry, whose left-wing views and record scared a lot of people. (Yes, I held my nose and voted for Bush.) Had the Democrats nominated a more moderate candidate, I think Bush would have lost.

Nobody could argue that the people of Iraq are safer today...Saddam was a brutal dictator, but at least the Iraqis could go to work, or shop, or live their lives without fear of being blown up by terrorists. Between the US armed forces and the terrorists and insurgents, Iraq is now an extremely dangerous place for anybody to be.

Regarding the original theme of this thread, I think four years of low-paid, high-stress, 24/7/365 service in a Presidential cabinet is enough for anybody. God bless Colin Powell and the others for their service to our country.
first off Hussain had WMD`s...without a doubt thank the UN for giving him over ten years to get rid of them....as far as not needing to go to war....ask the thousands of innocent Iraqi`s who were murdered by him........if you think we didn`t need to go to war against him then you must think we shouldn`t of went to war against Hitler

[regs1]

I believe everyone is making one basic mistake; we are starting to believe our own press. Did Hussain had WMD, the answer is yes, but the key word is had, at time of invasion it was proven that the WMD were destroyed, and Hussain was running a bluff.
Hog you are right Hussain did use WMD against his own people, but Bush's Dad gave him the correct warning in Desert Storm about the use of WMD against American troops.
Is the invasion of Iraq justified, only history will prove that.

The problem I have is that we have no clear objective in this war, does Iraq have to be just like us, I do not have the answer. If someone say Iraq should be just like us, I ask why, what right do we have to dictate socialogy to other countries.

The people who are leaving Bush cabinet, like everything else life goes on, and has anyone had the thought that these guys just wish to have a private life without the press.

[hog]

regs1......not only WMD but terrorist training camps also........this war if it didn`t happen now ....would of soon and been worse

[LT Mick]

Top Ten Things Overheard At The Opening Of The Clinton Library

10. "I'm sorry, this part of the library is strictly for 21-and-over."

9. "A library in Arkansas--well, now I've seen everything."

8. "The hours are 9 to ???"

7. "This is the first presidential library I've seen with hourly rates."

6. "He has the largest collection of adult magazines since Herbert Hoover."

5. "Don't forget to try the snack bar's impeachment cobbler."

4. "That concludes our ceremony--you're all invited to stay for ham hocks and moonshine."

3. "Damn, Bubba has a huge desk."

2. "It's the only presidential library with a ladies' night."

1. "Security to the front--Kerry is here sobbing again."

[eyeofthestorm]

Why are so many appointies from Bush's cabinet resigning?
every cabinet secretary resigns at the end of a term no matter what the case may be. They do it as a formality so that the president doesnt have to fire them if he chooses to make a change or in the case that they want to quit they wont embarass the president by quitting.

[eyeofthestorm]

Why in the hell have we become the world police? the US has been the "world police" since the end of World War II.That was the big watershead which made us the official "world police." We got REALLY involved in policing the world during the Kennedy-Johnson (Democratic) era. The US has been trying to be the "world police" since the days of Theodore Roosevelt.

[SouthsideLadderMan]

We may not agree with the same politics, but that was FUNNY! :D

[LT Mick]

Now we see that DHS Sec Ridge is leaving too!!!!!!!! HMMMMMMMMM???
Now who is going to tell us when to buy plastic & Duct tape? :rolleyes:

[Emtmom]

Yep, another one bites the dust!

[eyeofthestorm]

Now we see that DHS Sec Ridge is leaving too People in his office said he was going to resign a long time ago because of family issues. This is no suprise.

[burning85]

True EYE...Ridge said so himself. I would just like to bring this to the table to think about...poeple like to put the blame of the war, terrorism, the status of the economy on President Bush. Honestly it's not like all of these examples and more weren't already headed down the drain before Bush got into office...Go back and do some research,the countries deficit was growing before Bush was elected and it's not like it was some miniscule amount that sky rocketed as soon as Bush was in office. It will still be growing after he leaves office and the next presidents term is due. So the deficit's greater now then ever before, of course it is, these past 4 years have brought up issues that needed to be dealt with and money needed to be spent to support them. September 11th brought on the war on terror, and you can't put the blame on the President or intellegnce failure for 9-11....that plan of attack was put into works years before he was president. There hasnt been a major attack on American soil since Pearl Harbor.Actions needed to be taken. So the search of Osama Bin Laden was coming up empty handed, no one has stopped the pursuit of him, but a new and great threat in Hussein came up, and the President felt it necassary to take action to protect our country. The whole thing of -well there were no WMD...can anyone honestly believe that intellegence could have made an error that big? With all the time prior to Bush being elected and the time weapons inspectors got over to Iraq ,Hussein had plenty of time to get rid of the weapons one way or another. There is good coming out of the invasion of Iraq, and if you go on just what the news reports you will never know that. The people of Iraq have never had a voice, have never had any freedom they now are on their way to having what Americans are blessed with. They now have an interum government set up, they now have new direction to have their lives bettered! No matter who's president as long as this worlds still spinning, there will be wars, there will be hatred, there will be jeslousy against the U.S. and there will be people trying to end our freedom. I'm thankful every day there are men and women out there protecting our freedom, freedom isn't free. And im glad we have a president that supports our military and backs it up how ever he can!

[LT Mick]

"the countries deficit was growing before Bush was elected and it's not like it was some miniscule amount"

Bull Shit

Clinton might have been a womenizing scum bag who thought getting a BJ was not sex, but our economy was good until the election of 2000. Go back and look at the Wall Street Journal. It is a fact the stock market tumbled within days of electing this jackass!!!! Now we can't pay our bills! Just raise the debt limit. Wouldn't that be nice to do that with your credit limit? Federal Deficit, Clinton had a BALANCED budget!!!!!!!!!

Day after this election, London times headline!
"How can 59,000,000 people be so DUMB?"
Good question how can anybody support this f---ing phony christisn jackass? Now you will all have to live with him and his fanitacal christian supporters. If Jerry Falwell and his fanitics have their way, we will go back 20 years, with their puritanical beliefs, and SHOVE t :mad: hem down our throats. NO THANK YOU.

[hog]

"the countries deficit was growing before Bush was elected and it's not like it was some miniscule amount"

Bull Shit

Clinton might have been a womenizing scum bag who thought getting a BJ was not sex, but our economy was good until the election of 2000. Go back and look at the Wall Street Journal. It is a fact the stock market tumbled within days of electing this jackass!!!! Now we can't pay our bills! Just raise the debt limit. Wouldn't that be nice to do that with your credit limit? Federal Deficit, Clinton had a BALANCED budget!!!!!!!!!

Day after this election, London times headline!
"How can 59,000,000 people be so DUMB?"
Good question how can anybody support this f---ing phony christisn jackass? Now you will all have to live with him and his fanitacal christian supporters. If Jerry Falwell and his fanitics have their way, we will go back 20 years, with their puritanical beliefs, and SHOVE t :mad: hem down our throats. NO THANK YOU.
and you think Kerry the traitor could of done better?..........first off Kerry lost so get over it second inflation was rising before Bush took office...third...Thank GOD that Bush won or we would have no money from all the taxes Kerry wanted to raise

[burning85]

LT. the stock market and Bushes election have nothing to do with each other who knows if gore was elected the same thing wouldnt have happend!!...and a balanced budget back when clinton was the president...maybe but when clinton was president we werent involved with what we are now!!!! 2 huge different stages right now!!!!

"Day after this election, London times headline! "
"How can 59,000,000 people be so DUMB?"

who cares what they have to say...they dont live mine or your life!!! the votes speak, what's done is done!!

[No Fear]

Through all the reports I read and heard the economy is doing well. Guess I'm one of those fucking dumbasses, but proud of it.

[Emtmom]

Through all the reports I read and heard the economy is doing well. Guess I'm one of those fucking dumbasses, but proud of it.Try telling that to all those who are laid off, and have been laid off for so long that thier unemplyment has run out. Unemployment has gone down because people ran out of benefits and BUSH refused to sign extensions! Do you have any idea what that's like, what it's like to have to live off your "retirement fund" so your kids can eat? Think about what it would be like to be in your 40's and have no retirement money left, because Bush just didn't think it was a good time to sign that extension. But, you still had to pay your mortgage and feed your kids! People who took whatever job was offered because they wanted to work, never mind they had to work, people who went from 20.00 and hour to 10.00 an hour. By no means is 20.00 an hour a big salary these days, but try living with that cut in half.
Then every year cut those federal programs that help those people keep thier heads above water. Once again the limit of income has been dropped on fuel assistance, and other programs. YET, we have no problem pouring money into foriegn countries, so thier people and thier kids don't starve. If BUSH wants to do something for this country then he needs to open his eyes, and realize that there are people in this country STARVING, and losing thier homes, because he keeps letting all these companies send jobs overseas. Start offering these companies a reason to stay here and keep US working! It is time for us to STOP being the WORLD POLICE! Start paying attention to OUR economy!!!
Sorry, got a little off track there! I see these people everyday, people who have never had to take a hand out before and here they are at the food bank looking for dinner for thier kids. Who without the fire deptartments (a few of the depts. here deliver toys) and toys for tots would have to explain to thier kids why there is no Christmas this year! People who are so afraid they will lose thier homes. People who hang thier heads in shame because they had to ask the state for medical insurance for thier kids. People with tears in thier eyes when you show up at thier door with a tree, you know they can't afford.
Then tell me how damn good the economy is!!! Better yet, TELL THEM!

getting down off the soap box now!

[Emtmom]

September 11th brought on the war on terror, and you can't put the blame on the President or intellegnce failure for 9-11....that plan of attack was put into works years before he was president. There hasnt been a major attack on American soil since Pearl Harbor.Actions needed to be taken. So the search of Osama Bin Laden was coming up empty handed, no one has stopped the pursuit of him, but a new and great threat in Hussein came up, and the President felt it necassary to take action to protect our country. The whole thing of -well there were no WMD...can anyone honestly believe that intellegence could have made an error that big? With all the time prior to Bush being elected and the time weapons inspectors got over to Iraq ,Hussein had plenty of time to get rid of the weapons one way or another. There is good coming out of the invasion of Iraq, and if you go on just what the news reports you will never know that. The people of Iraq have never had a voice, have never had any freedom they now are on their way to having what Americans are blessed with. They now have an interum government set up, they now have new direction to have their lives bettered! No matter who's president as long as this worlds still spinning, there will be wars, there will be hatred, there will be jeslousy against the U.S. and there will be people trying to end our freedom. I'm thankful every day there are men and women out there protecting our freedom, freedom isn't free. And im glad we have a president that supports our military and backs it up how ever he can!You don't honestly believe that 9/11 was what started the war on terror do you???? Clinton stopped an attack on LAX way before 9/11 and we were bombing Al queda training camps when Clinton was president. The man BUSH kept for security he kept because he was the man who warned Clinton and kept the Clinton cabinet updated on threats. Which is how they stopped the attack at LAX. BUSH was WARNED and did NOTHING! Not even so much as a meeting of his cabinet. The CIA and the FBI each thought the other was handling the threat....WHY??? Because BUSH never had a meeting with them together so one hand would know what the other was doing! Then after 9/11 he fires the man who was "perfect for the job, look at his record with the Clinton administration". Because he tells the press that Bush ignored him, and he's an idiot? NO, BUSH is the idiot! YES, you can blame Bush when he did NOTHING to prevent it! Even Colin Powell told Bush to stay out of Iraq, that it was the wrong time, Hussein was NOT a threat to US! YES OBVIOUSLY INTELLIGENCE DOES MAKE MISTAKES THAT BIG!
The people of Iraq are free only of Sadam, now they live in fear of insurgents. They can't work, they can't go to school, how is that good for them????? Thier lives are threatened more now than they ever were.
AHH yes Bush backing the military......hmmm....know many military families? I know several, with kids, who are on welfare because of how POORLY this Govt. pays the military. Those men and women put thier lives on the line everyday, and we don't pay them enough to feed thier kids! These are families that live in on base housing, I am talking about. When they get raises, and get the equipment they need, SAFE equipment, equipment that keeps them SAFE, You know like Hummers that actually have armor! Then tell me how much Bush supports our troops. Isn't Bush the one cutting SUB BASES???? OH, but then if you don't have one in your state that is on the chopping block you don't know that. Cuts in the military, seems like a bad time for that don't ya think???????
Do you think it's right for Bush to allow civilians to go over to Iraq to work, do you think it's safe for them? OR did you ever ask yourself why they feel the need to do it? Most of them said they are doing it because..THEY WILL LOSE THIER HOMES WITHOUT THOSE JOBS. Why...because there are NO JOBS HERE! How sad is that, what does that say for Bush?
I support out Troops, it doesn't mean I agree with Bush, and it certainly doesn't mean I have to support him.

[burning85]

the attack of 9-11 sparked the war on terrorism to the extent that it is today...yes i do know military members...i know a man personally that is on his second tour over there!!! he told me things that people that arent over there don't know about ...the good thats going on and the betterment of things over there...and the point im trying to make is...no matter who is president shit like this will be happening...so "stop policing the world" ok forget about all of the other nations who are planning everday...before bush was president, while bush is president and after bush leaves office to attack us again...no body forced any one to sign up for the military...there was no draft ...people signed up on their own free will so if they signed up thinking they could fulfil their time and get an easy check, then shame on them! and bush isnt making any civilian go work in iraq these people are volunteering!! ok lets say u are president for the month...you get thousands of threats and reports coming in every week...how do you determine which ones you are going to take seriously and follow through with time and money to pursue it?? Bush was in office 9 months before september 11th...before that it was BILL CLINTON who cut defense and intellegence budget, it was BILL CLINTON who declined arresting osoma bin laden when the Sudanese arrested him in their country...it was BILL CLINTON who's mess George Bush got to try and straighten out!!! reported facts!!! ive researched, ive read!!! so now honestly you can't put the blame on Bush for September 11th!!!! And since bush has been in office he increased Military pay by 7-10%....once again researched and read...so before throwing mixed opinions in whith half truths and heresay ...read up!!!
the LAX prevevention was a dumb luck strike by a border patrol guard at the Canadian border!! there was no big clinton and intellegence teamwork!!! once again researched!!

and as for our economy and unemployment...our unemployment rate is down to 5.4%..which as low as when Clinton was in office at it's lowest point! and that stage with Clinton was refered to "the best economy ever"...
and while Bush has been in office..once more let me state...that he has been raising the military budget for pay increases and safer equipment...once again he has to try and right everything that Clinton messed up!!!! i dont know where your info's coming from, but talking to people and taking what they say as factual is heresay-listening to the evening news will leave you no where-but then again no one says you have to support President Bush... if your going to agure facts against him though make sure thats what they are-facts.

[Emtmom]

the attack of 9-11 sparked the war on terrorism to the extent that it is today...yes i do know military members...i know a man personally that is on his second tour over there!!! he told me things that people that arent over there don't know about ...the good thats going on and the betterment of things over there...and the point im trying to make is...no matter who is president shit like this will be happening...so "stop policing the world" ok forget about all of the other nations who are planning everday...before bush was president, while bush is president and after bush leaves office to attack us again...no body forced any one to sign up for the military...there was no draft ...people signed up on their own free will so if they signed up thinking they could fulfil their time and get an easy check, then shame on them! So because they signed up it's ok for this Govt. to pay them squat?????? I don't think so! and bush isnt making any civilian go work in iraq these people are volunteering!! If they had thier jobs still in this country they wouldn't feel the need to go there! ok lets say u are president for the month...you get thousands of threats and reports coming in every week...how do you determine which ones you are going to take seriously and follow through with time and money to pursue it?? Well if you don't check them all then I would guess we want another 9/11????Bush was in office 9 months before september 11th...before that it was BILL CLINTON who cut defense and intellegence budget, it was BILL CLINTON who declined arresting osoma bin laden when the Sudanese arrested him in their country...it was BILL CLINTON who's mess George Bush got to try and straighten out!!! reported facts!!! ive researched, ive read!!! so now honestly you can't put the blame on Bush for September 11th!!!! [quote]I can and will put some of the blame on BUSH, just as the 09/11 commission did! Had he had meetings of his cabinet members so each dept. KNEW what the other was doing, they may have been able to prevent some of what has happened! did Clinton turn down the Sudanese....YES he did, it was a MISTAKE.....Just like BUSH ATTACKING IRAQ WAS A MISTAKE![quote} And since bush has been in office he increased Military pay by 7-10%....once again researched and read...so before throwing mixed opinions in whith half truths and heresay ...read up!!!Which is OBVIOULSY NOT ENOUGH! Since thier pay was CRAP to begin with that amount did NOTHING for them. Most with families find it better for thier families if they leave the military, instead of going for the pension. Obviously, that says alot for the pay and benefits our Govt. gives! The LOW pay is not a half truth, it is the TRUTH, they do not get paid what they are worth!
the LAX prevevention was a dumb luck strike by a border patrol guard at the Canadian border!! there was no big clinton and intellegence teamwork!!! once again researched!!Research again, the cabinet met weekly to share information, which is how they knew where the training camps were and when to strike them! Also how they knew what the other intelligence brances were doing, things were being investigated and dealt with. If the CIA and FBI both think the other is dealing with something, but they are not talking to be sure, something like 9/11 happens! That believe it or not is how the Govt. SHOULD WORK! AS A TEAM!!!!!

and as for our economy and unemployment...our unemployment rate is down to 5.4%..which as low as when Clinton was in office at it's lowest point! and that stage with Clinton was refered to "the best economy ever"...Unemployment go3es down everytime another persons benefits run out....IT'S NOT BECAUSE THERE ARE JOBS! For the last 2 quarters the job rate has risen far less than unemployment! That should tell you that unemployment can't be going DOWN because people are working!
that he has been raising the military budget for pay increases and safer equipment...once again he has to try and right everything that Clinton messed up!!!! i dont know where your info's coming from, but talking to people and taking what they say as factual is heresay-listening to the evening news will leave you no where-but then again no one says you have to support President Bush... if your going to agure facts against him though make sure thats what they are-facts.A young man who just came back from Iraq 2 months ago is one, something tells me HE WOULD KNOW! So if Bush has made our military so safe, why are there convoys refusing to take supplies to our soldiers? OH NO wait let me tell you....BECAUSE THEIR TRUCKS HAVE NO ARMOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! OH yeah I'd call that safe equipment! YES, my friend did tell me there is some good going on, but at this point the insurgents out weigh the good. He said he now knows what it feels like to never be sure if that 10 yr old is going to shake your hand or shoot you! ARE YOU SURE WE PAY THEM ENOUGH?????????

[burning85]

He said he now knows what it feels like to never be sure if that 10 yr old is going to shake your hand or shoot you! ARE YOU SURE WE PAY THEM ENOUGH????????

i do agree with you on that....but i also feel that the insurgents that put kids up to tricks like that and the things they do themselves do need to be stopped.....and i thought being a soldier was more than a paycheck?? i thought the most part of it is dedication to our freedom and our country?? its not a job you take to turn it into a high paying career...like being a lawyer or teacher!!

[regs1]

High paying career teachers :confused:

I know a lot of money-crunched teachers, who barely have enough money to pay a mortgage, however I also know a lot of rich lawyers. :D

soldiers pay check?
Pay for soldiers, what is a privates pay these day, how about a major pays-

I believe someone become a soldier for something more than pay



Lets for once get our facts straight for once :D

[burning85]

I believe someone become a soldier for something more than pay

thats what i was sayin...lol hey i know a teacher that makes good money..depends on the disrict i guess:0) but u got my point!

[hog]

I believe someone become a soldier for something more than pay :D
thank God that these folks love this country enough to put their lives on the line for us.............it is about love for country

[Emtmom]

Teachers are definately NOT well paid.
Laywers are certainly high paid, or at least some.
I never said people who join the military do it for the money, or to get rich, but don't you think they should make enough to put food on the table and clothes on their kids backs? They put their lives on the line everyday, aren't they worth it! .
I think it's a shame that some our service families have to get food stamps to make ends meet.

[burning85]

well in my state and school district some teachers make 55+k a year...decent to me...and honestly maybe in your area these people are collecting food stamps but thats not evryone you cant generalize it to everybody...but if its the case that they do then yes you are right that is a shame.

[No Fear]

Mom I truly believe you are from California with some of your theories that you have brought out. Some of the things I am finding hard to believe and I see your still crying over Bush and that your man didn't make it. However I do find this a good debate , until you mentioned unemployment in this country and its my fault. I resent the fact that my vote caused all these people to lose their jobs. I truly am heartbroken that any hard working American would lose their jobs over their employers mismanagement or greed. I concede that I don't know all the facts about the unemployment and that you know what your talking about. Yes, I am truly blessed that I have chosen a profession that is secure. But, once again don't accused me of being the reason of their unemployment.

As far as civilians going overseas because there is no work is BS to. Their going over there to make lots and lots of money quickly. Hell if I didn't have a family I would go over there to. Making 6 figures in a few months or a year real good to me. Thats the reason they are going over there, not because of employment over here.

Military Pay. I can make a statement since I was a member of the armed forces and some of you comment that didn't serve. I volunteered to serve in the armed forces , and it was certainly not for the money. To me and me only I thought I had a duty to serve my country. The military provided me a place to sleep, provided me 3 meals a day, provided me dental and medical, provided me the chance to attend college, allowed me to bring my family from abroad and gave them medical and dental, allowed me to receive a COLA so I wouldn't have to worry about food stamps. And I got paid a helluva lot less back them. But I will agree, they are under paid, just like our firefighters and police officers. Anyone that puts their life on the line day in and day out deserves to be paid top dollar, but we all know that that will never happen.

As far as being shot by a 10 year old, we have to look at this country also. It happens at home to. And I agree we don't paid them enough.

Mom you think Clinton was a great military leader what happen in Somalia? What happen with their information sharing when the bombing of WTC occurred. What happen to the information sharing that would bring everyone to justice. Didn't happen did it.Do I blame Clinton for the lost of our American service men in Somalia , you bet I do.Do I blame Clinton for the first WTC incident,nope. No one knew that would happen that day, just like Bush or anybody else knew what going to happen on 9/11. NO ONE KNEW. But if you are looking for someone to blame, blame it on airport security. Will that make everyone happy.

As far as the FBI and CIA, well what can I say. Both of the agencies have the how great thou are attitude and have their heads stuck up on their asses so far that the sun only shines on them. There was no cooperation on any information sharing with any law enforcement agency from the CIA and FBI, to include the Clinton era, and the matter of fact any era. Things are a little better, but there still hiding info some how some way, that the nature of their agencies. I know I worked with them.

Hope no hard feeling just stating the facts

[medic5]

It's amazing how twisted information gets by those who hate Bush so much. Take for example that fat fuck communist extremist pig eating Michael Moore. That man would argue the sky was orange if a Republican told him it was blue. This is how these people are. The liberal crybabies are still bitching about Bush's win. So what? Get over it, and move on. If you hate it that much, you are more than welcome to share Canada's oxygen, more here for us who do love our country (good times and bad.) Better yet, perhaps if the democrats in this country gave enough shits about this election and felt as strongly as the crybabies out here, they would've gotten out and voted. Obviously, the Republicans do care a bit more, because they went out and made their voices heard, all 59 million of them.

Now I will agree with the statements about our military. These wonderful people put their lives on the line everyday, and they get paid squat. But an ambulance chasing low life lawyer handing out business cards in the ER's can make 6 figures or better. A steroid using baseball player, or one of Baltimore Raven's felons can go out and make 7 or 8 figures per year. What do these people do for our country? Hell, some of them can't even pay taxes. I applaud these brave men and women who serve our country every single day. If not just for my freedom, but also for those crybaby democrats' freedom to openly whine about George Bush.

[eyeofthestorm]

You know like Hummers that actually have armor Hummers arent designed for armor. They are sending over kits that can upgrade them to it.

As far as military spending, I can vagely remember certain democrats yelling about the huge defict and that we should cut spending.

Military Pay, of course soldiers should be paid more, just like teachers, police officers and firefighters. But people who do these jobs dont do it for the money. Hell, i run into burning buildings for free, but thats another debate that i dont want to touch with a 10 foot pole. People who take these jobs do it because they want to make a difference. Sure the lawyer makes a difference and helps people who need it, but the lawyer is in a profession where he can charge as much as he wants for his services and can pick and choose his work. The military, teachers, firefighters and police, we have to do our jobs and we cant decide who we help or dont, we help everyone. People who persue public service jobs (im including the military and teachers in that category) dont do it for the material things, they do it because they want to make a difference. Personally, i dont care how much i get paid when i get out of school, im going to be a public servant and thats something that the country needs more then other professions.


YET, we have no problem pouring money into foriegn countries, so thier people and thier kids don't starve. If BUSH wants to do something for this country then he needs to open his eyes, and realize that there are people in this country STARVING, and losing thier homes, because he keeps letting all these companies send jobs overseas. Start offering these companies a reason to stay here and keep US working! It is time for us to STOP being the WORLD POLICE! Start paying attention to OUR economy!!!
If you honestly think that in the 21st century the United States should isolate itself from globalization, youre an idiot. Free trade and globalization is a good thing, not only for the entire world, but for the US. Goods are cheaper, food is cheaper, jobs in the US are going to become more high tech, meaning that they will be higher paying. Perhaps the number one reason for globalization, IT STOPS WARS. Seriously, since we began to globalize, have we gone to war with any nation that we trade with??? Iraq, Afghanistan, Bosnia. Last time I checked, we werent trading with them when we went to war. Its a new century and an isolationist policy in both economics and foreign policy will only hinder the US.

[Emtmom]

Mom I truly believe you are from California with some of your theories that you have brought out. Some of the things I am finding hard to believe and I see your still crying over Bush and that your man didn't make it. However I do find this a good debate , until you mentioned unemployment in this country and its my fault. I resent the fact that my vote caused all these people to lose their jobs. I truly am heartbroken that any hard working American would lose their jobs over their employers mismanagement or greed. I concede that I don't know all the facts about the unemployment and that you know what your talking about. Yes, I am truly blessed that I have chosen a profession that is secure. But, once again don't accused me of being the reason of their unemployment. I never said it was your fault, I'm saying Bush should be ofering thes companies something to help keep jobs in this country. I'm not crying over Bush, just because he is president doesn't mean I have to agree wiht him and all of his policies. No matter who the president is I don't have to agree with all their decisions and policies.

As far as civilians going overseas because there is no work is BS to. Their going over there to make lots and lots of money quickly. Hell if I didn't have a family I would go over there to. Making 6 figures in a few months or a year real good to me. Thats the reason they are going over there, not because of employment over here.When they were interviewed about going there, and those interviewed that were there, from their OWN mouths, they said they were there because they could not find work here. They did not want to lose their homes, and they wanted to provide for their families. Guess they must be liars huh?

Military Pay. I can make a statement since I was a member of the armed forces and some of you comment that didn't serve. I volunteered to serve in the armed forces , and it was certainly not for the money. To me and me only I thought I had a duty to serve my country. The military provided me a place to sleep, provided me 3 meals a day, provided me dental and medical, provided me the chance to attend college, allowed me to bring my family from abroad and gave them medical and dental, allowed me to receive a COLA so I wouldn't have to worry about food stamps. And I got paid a helluva lot less back them. But I will agree, they are under paid, just like our firefighters and police officers. Anyone that puts their life on the line day in and day out deserves to be paid top dollar, but we all know that that will never happen.You're right it will never happen, but they damn well deserve better pay! FF's, Police, EMT/Medic's and the military!



Mom you think Clinton was a great military leader what happen in Somalia? What happen with their information sharing when the bombing of WTC occurred. What happen to the information sharing that would bring everyone to justice. Didn't happen did it.Do I blame Clinton for the lost of our American service men in Somalia , you bet I do.Do I blame Clinton for the first WTC incident,nope. No one knew that would happen that day, just like Bush or anybody else knew what going to happen on 9/11. NO ONE KNEW. But if you are looking for someone to blame, blame it on airport security. Will that make everyone happy.NEVER said he was a great military leader, what I said was he made the heads of the cabinet meet so they each knew what the other was doing, therefore better equiped to catch things before they happened. I think that all started after WTC, every leader makes mistakes. No matter who thye are, and they will continue to do so, no matter who's butt is in the chair in the oval office.

As far as the FBI and CIA, well what can I say. Both of the agencies have the how great thou are attitude and have their heads stuck up on their asses so far that the sun only shines on them. There was no cooperation on any information sharing with any law enforcement agency from the CIA and FBI, to include the Clinton era, and the matter of fact any era. Things are a little better, but there still hiding info some how some way, that the nature of their agencies. I know I worked with them.Which is why them and other cabinet members meeting at least once a week is so important. MAYBE someday they will learn to play well together! lol

Hope no hard feeling just stating the factsNone at all hon, a good debate is a good thing! As long as there are no personal attacks, I don't take any of it personally.

[regs1]

Emtmom

While I respect you opinions on this, I believe you might have some items wrong.

Unemployment:

This is not as simple as some people state, eyeofthestorm states that manufacturing jobs are being replaced by high tech jobs, true statement, but since most of the jobs are high tech, these for the most part out sourced, a classic example, web site design, try to get a job in an American company as a designer, they are just not there, it simplier and much cheaper to get the information, and sub contract to a Indian company, you have a complete working website back in two days. In fact most data processing is outsourced the same way. In today Washington post there is an interesting article about schwinn bicycle and what happen to that company. The article pretty well states what has happen to US manufacturing. It this the fault of any one political party, NO, it’s the fault of both.

Burning85

Teacher around here start at 35k to maybe 40k for specialized training. They top out around 55-60k. However the average house cost around 400k+. Do the math, unless they inherited money they going to have a long commute. The same problems for police, and fire.

Military.

Pay – I live by a military base, it’s indecent what these guys are paid. Most of the unlisted personal with families qualify for food stamps and section 8 housing. To make the statement that they do it for pay, it’s insulting to everyone who was in the military.

Iraq –

The military needs a mission statement. If you wish to rebuild a nation, the military are just the wrong people for it. They are there to fight, and takes names. Last time we tried to rebuild a nation was Vietnam, look what happen there. Rebuild, if military is to be used, Army Corps of Engineers, let the supervise everything, and then Sub-contract out to our supporting nations corporations.
The county is more of a mess now then before the removal of Sadam. All we are doing now is throwing more manpower and more money at the problem. This has not worked in the past, will not work now. Besides, if you think taxes are going to stay low, who do you think going to have to pay for this war, and the Iraq rebuilding effort.

eyeofthestorm – hummers, they are built armored and unarmored, the buildup in Iraq just overwhelmed the number of necessary vehicles, thusly unarmored hummers were sent simply to supply necessary transport needs, mistake, probably, but there is a lot more to that issue, information can be found on the websites dealing with this issue.

Ok I stopping here, I can go on for pages on what been said, but to all, stop believing our own press, and to some what you hear in high school and college.

[burning85]

Burning85

Teacher around here start at 35k to maybe 40k for specialized training. They top out around 55-60k. However the average house cost around 400k+. Do the math, unless they inherited money they going to have a long commute. The same problems for police, and fire.

well i brought teachers up to make a point...not to try and start a whole debate...and as for houses costing 400+K...then any person with a fairly well paying job would be in trouble...must be different areas cause decent, nice houses cost half that around here!!! p.s. ive been outta highschool and college and i don't listen to the news ;0)

[burning85]

lol by the way..totally impressed we all carried on a civilized debate!!!

[Emtmom]

Unemployment:

This is not as simple as some people state, eyeofthestorm states that manufacturing jobs are being replaced by high tech jobs, true statement, but since most of the jobs are high tech, these for the most part out sourced, a classic example, web site design, try to get a job in an American company as a designer, they are just not there, it simplier and much cheaper to get the information, and sub contract to a Indian company, you have a complete working website back in two days. In fact most data processing is outsourced the same way. In today Washington post there is an interesting article about schwinn bicycle and what happen to that company. The article pretty well states what has happen to US manufacturing. It this the fault of any one political party, NO, it’s the fault of both.
I agree that it is not one political party, but there has to be something that can be offered these companies to get them to keep some of this stuff here. Let's just take the web site and data processing. I know plenty of stay at home moms who would LOVE the data processing work. Makes you an independent contractor, they can pay you less, because they send you the work, you are at home, and they DON'T have to pay any benefits! Shoot I do web design, think I can find companies to pay me to do it, nope. I would work cheap, I figure no vehicle expenses, no food expense, no day care. A nice little pay check to pay a couple bills every month and help out hubby. Telecommutting jobs would be great for some of us.
Regs....we like your novels! lol

[Emtmom]

I found this intesting!

Disgruntled Troops Complain to Rumsfeld

2 hours, 25 minutes ago Middle East - AP


By ROBERT BURNS, AP Military Writer

CAMP BUEHRING, Kuwait - Disgruntled U.S. soldiers complained to Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld on Wednesday about the lack of armor for their vehicles and long deployments, drawing a blunt retort from the Pentagon chief.


"You go to war with the Army you have," he said in a rare public airing of rank-and-file concerns among the troops.


In his prepared remarks earlier, Rumsfeld had urged the troops — mostly National Guard and Reserve soldiers — to discount critics of the war in Iraq (news - web sites) and to help "win the test of wills" with the insurgents.


Some of soldiers, however, had criticisms of their own — not of the war itself but of how it is being fought.


Army Spc. Thomas Wilson, for example, of the 278th Regimental Combat Team that is comprised mainly of citizen soldiers of the Tennessee Army National Guard, asked Rumsfeld in a question-and-answer session why vehicle armor is still in short supply, nearly two years after the start of the war that ousted Iraqi President Saddam Hussein.


"Why do we soldiers have to dig through local landfills for pieces of scrap metal and compromised ballistic glass to uparmor our vehicles?" Wilson asked. A big cheer arose from the approximately 2,300 soldiers in the cavernous hangar who assembled to see and hear the secretary of defense.


Rumsfeld hesitated and asked Wilson to repeat his question.


"We do not have proper armored vehicles to carry with us north," Wilson said after asking again.


Rumsfeld replied that troops should make the best of the conditions they face and said the Army was pushing manufacturers of vehicle armor to produce it as fast as humanly possible.


And, the defense chief added, armor is not always a savior in the kind of combat U.S. troops face in Iraq, where the insurgents' weapon of choice is the roadside bomb, or improvised explosive device that has killed and maimed hundreds, if not thousands, of American troops since the summer of 2003.


"You can have all the armor in the world on a tank and it can (still) be blown up," Rumsfeld said.


Asked later about Wilson's complaint, the deputy commanding general of U.S. forces in Kuwait, Maj. Gen. Gary Speer, said in an interview that as far as he knows, every vehicle that is deploying to Iraq from Camp Buehring in Kuwait has at least "Level 3" armor. That means it at least has locally fabricated armor for its side panels, but not necessarily bulletproof windows or protection against explosions that penetrate the floorboard.


Speer said he was not aware that soldiers were searching landfills for scrap metal and used bulletproof glass.


During the question-and-answer session, another soldier complained that active-duty Army units sometimes get priority over the National Guard and Reserve units for the best equipment in Iraq.


"There's no way I can prove it, but I am told the Army is breaking its neck to see that there is not" discrimination against the National Guard and Reserve in terms of providing equipment, Rumsfeld said.


Yet another soldier asked, without putting it to Rumsfeld as a direct criticism, how much longer the Army will continue using its "stop loss" power to prevent soldiers from leaving the service who are otherwise eligible to retire or quit.


Rumsfeld said that this condition was simply a fact of life for soldiers at time of war.





"It's basically a sound principle, it's nothing new, it's been well understood" by soldiers, he said. "My guess is it will continue to be used as little as possible, but that it will continue to be used."

In his opening remarks, Rumsfeld stressed that soldiers who are heading to Iraq should not believe those who say the insurgents cannot be defeated or who otherwise doubt the will of the military to win.

"They say we can't prevail. I see that violence and say we must win," Rumsfeld said.

[joefireman]

Okay. One soldier asked Mr. Rumsfeld about Hummers with inadequate armor. Mine is a mobile unit(not CURRENTLY deployed) hell,for us, less armor equals higher mobility and higher mobility equals less targeting opportunity. Maybe they can have ours, besides that stuff makes me sweat. As for the guy suing for his discharge, hell, I'll take his place.

[Emtmom]

Okay. One soldier asked Mr. Rumsfeld about Hummers with inadequate armor. Mine is a mobile unit(not CURRENTLY deployed) hell,for us, less armor equals higher mobility and higher mobility equals less targeting opportunity. Maybe they can have ours, besides that stuff makes me sweat. As for the guy suing for his discharge, hell, I'll take his place.OK, let me make this VERY clear to you hon. If you get activated, I'm coming down there and kidnapping you, and bringing you back here, tieing you up and locking you in my closet! I like you safe, and in one piece!!!!

[hog]

Okay. One soldier asked Mr. Rumsfeld about Hummers with inadequate armor. Mine is a mobile unit(not CURRENTLY deployed) hell,for us, less armor equals higher mobility and higher mobility equals less targeting opportunity. Maybe they can have ours, besides that stuff makes me sweat. As for the guy suing for his discharge, hell, I'll take his place.
AMEN brother.......Thank God we have folks like you in our Armed Forces......god bless and stay safe

[EMT/FF99]

Okay. One soldier asked Mr. Rumsfeld about Hummers with inadequate armor. Mine is a mobile unit(not CURRENTLY deployed) hell,for us, less armor equals higher mobility and higher mobility equals less targeting opportunity. Maybe they can have ours, besides that stuff makes me sweat. As for the guy suing for his discharge, hell, I'll take his place.
Damn Kenny,, dont show up in the other group,,LOL,,,no I find you here versing with Nancy & Scott!!! LOL,,dont worry just bustin your chops

[Emtmom]

Damn Kenny,, dont show up in the other group,,LOL,,,no I find you here versing with Nancy & Scott!!! LOL,,dont worry just bustin your chopsLeave him alone! He had a rough 3 weeks!

[EMT/FF99]

Leave him alone! He had a rough 3 weeks!
Playing in the Desert?? Making Sandcastles & blowing them up?? Guess that would be rough!!!!

[joefireman]

VERSING?!?!?!?!?!? That there's a five dollah wurd. Amanada thought I didn't write anything too. I'm still here. Hell, I'm there too.

[EMT/FF99]

VERSING?!?!?!?!?!? That there's a five dollah wurd. Amanada thought I didn't write anything too. I'm still here. Hell, I'm there too.
ROFLMFAO!!!!!!!!!!! I meant to say "conversing" but what do you expect for a person whom types 3 fingered!!! LOL Just bustin your chops about the other group :D

[LT Mick]

Well Good Ole' Gw has done it again. One month after his relection and now his approval rating is down below 50%.

First time in history that a newly re-elected President had such a POOR approval rating right after election.

Apparently FINALLY some bullheaded, blind, gullable SO & SOs have finally seen him for the lying dumb S&^t that he is. Too abd they did not see it 6 weeks ago. Now we are stuck with the SOB for another 4 years of lying, and eroding civil rights (USA Patriot Act) from this dumbass Good Ole Boy.

The man is dumber than a box of rocks. his VP is as crooked as an appalachian mountain road.

Tim P. McMenamin
An honest bleeding heart proud liberal died in the wool DEMOCRAT!