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View Full Version : This is sure to make your blood boil. What the "Blue" Staters really think


SouthsideLadderMan
11-23-2004, 11:05 AM
What a fuckin' joke this guy is.



Screw you, America

Sometimes the fish in the barrel deserve to die

B Y C L I F G A R B O D E N

America speaks with one voice. Unfortunately, it emanates from its ass.
--Barry Crimmins
November 17, 2004

N E W S F E A T U R E


Don't forgive my anger. All this needs to be said. And I know that as soon as that stiff-faced to-the-manure-born right-wing lackey in the White House tries to appoint a 21st-century counterpart to Roy Bean to the Supreme Court in a few weeks, more people are going to wish they'd said it sooner. John Kerry fucked up. More important, America fucked up. And the people who fucked up the most--you infamous red-staters--are going to suffer along with the rest of us. To put it in lingo a NASCAR devotee would understand, "Y'all deserve a good talkin'-to." John F. Kerry, you're first.

In your befuddling concession speech, you actually called for unity and healing. Sounds good, clown, but can't you even imagine for a second that the people who supported you so zealously for the past five months might just see that insincere gesture of good sportsmanship as a betrayal? See, unlike you pols, we voters actually believe in shit. We believe that George W. Bush and his henchpeople are a real threat to the survival of democracy. We believe that they're killing people for profit. And we believe that they don't have a goddamn clue about forfending terrorism on U.S. soil.

That's not a position gap; that's an ideological gash. And it's not going to heal, because, unlike you expedient professional truth-manipulators, I'm not prepared to meet the enemies of freedom halfway just because you lost the election. Your speechwriters might see the Bush administration's failings as nothing more than convenient fodder for your campaign blather, but the GOP junta's sins don't go away just because decrying them no longer serves your ambitions. Last week they were the imperialist pigs who misled us into war and you were the savior. Now we're the goddamn Getalong Gang?! Screw that. Fight back or shut up.

Now, the rest of you. ...

A lot of us effete Easterners want to know: What the fuck is wrong with you?! You voted against your self-interest at every turn (you dumb-asses in South Dakota deserve special credit for voting out one of the most powerful Democrats in the Senate) and re-elected an ignorant cowboy who can't be trusted to remember a lunch order, never mind run a country. What in the name of God...?! Wait, it was in the name of God, wasn't it? Rendered weak and ignorant by a spoon-fed climate of fear, you slack-jawed inbred flatlanders have sought refuge in the traditional twin towers of mindlessness--jingoistic patriotism and fundamentalist religion. God's on your side. Like hell. Jesus loves us, dammit.

Okay, you want God? Let's talk about God. Your religion is bogus. Fundamentalism, the facile belief in the unexplained and un-researched, is something you born-agains (couldn't get it right the first time, huh?) share with Al Qaeda, whose ideologues doggedly adhere to religious misinterpretations every bit as silly and dangerous as yours. Just like you, Muslim fundamentalists long to impose an unrealistic and intolerant pseudo-Calvinist morality on the world. In fact, America's religious right has so much in common with the Shiah, it's a wonder you guys don't invite them to join the Rotary. Born-againsters look for the face of Christ in the wallpaper; fundamentalist Muslims hallucinate the voice of the 12th Imam; but aside from that (and extremely divergent attitudes toward pork), you both hate the same stuff--homosexuality, pacifism, Jews, education, uppity women, enlightenment, short skirts, gangsta rap, tattoos, infidels. ... (They also share your love of super-lethal weaponry.)

Well, sorry to burst your holy bubble, Jesus freaks, but God did not create the world in seven days; that's just ignorant. Like a lot of stuff in the Bible, it didn't happen. And Moses looked more like Jeff Goldblum than like Charlton Heston. Jesus didn't hunt; he fished. Jesus wouldn't want you (or anyone else) to have an assault rifle. What would Jesus do if he met you? He'd ask you to stop ruining his hard-won good reputation. (Y'know the guy died to redeem your sorry ass; you might at least show a little respect for what he was really about.)

What else is bothering you self-destructive morons? What other overwhelmingly urgent issue caused you to vote yourselves into the retirement poorhouse and sacrifice the four freedoms? Gay marriage? Dig it. Right at this moment in your little picturesque insular East Silage-for-Brains, U.S.A., there are gay and lesbian couples walking around--possibly even copulating. Really. It's been going on around you all your lives, and you've never been hurt by it. Now, if these same couples were "married" in any legal sense, they'd still walk and copulate as usual and it still wouldn't make any difference to you. You don't like or understand homosexuality? Fine. Nobody's asking your permission. But it's not your problem. And hiding it won't make it go away. Nor will persecuting gays change anybody's sexual preference. So, to put it aptly, go fuck yourselves and leave other people alone.

Anything else? Education deform ... er, reform. Some of you weren't even born the first time when, in 1968, legendary secular-humanist prophet Frank Zappa wrote: "All your children are poor unfortunate victims of lies you believe. A plague upon your ignorance that keeps the young from the truth they deserve." We repeat, creationism is absurd. Yet in the name of protecting this ridiculous and irrelevant belief, you toothless crank-heads are willing to eschew all science and learning this side of Copernicus. (Or do you still think the sun orbits the earth?) The Bushies really are on your side here. Leaders like G.W. and (yes, it's a fair comparison) Hitler rise to power by exploiting the support of the weak and stupid, so it's in their interest to encourage weakness and stupidity. That's where universal education becomes a threat. Education encourages creative thought. Creative thought empowers people. Fascists hate creative thought. So it's incredibly convenient for the GOP that you folks actually want your kids to be dumb. Which is why the No Child Left Behind initiative you endorse has, in fact, done nothing! Happy? Perhaps ignorance really is bliss.

What else is on your hate-laden Limbaugh-laid table? Flag burning? It's just cloth, guys. Sex ed? Heaven forbid your daughters learned the facts of life in time to prevent having to avoid an abortion.

Gun control? We said "control," not confiscation. And there are high-powered automatic weapons most civilians really do not need. Even moose tend to come at you one at a time. "But shooting's fun!" you argue. "It's a sport." Breaking windows and driving 100 miles an hour are fun, but they're legally controlled activities. "But," you object, "how do I defend my family when the nigras and the Jews and the Communists from Harvard come on my property?" Right. Lock the gate; everybody covets your Tupperware and your chard. We'll be right over.

Does it really bother you cornpone chuckleheads that "we" think you're under-educated, culturally limited and ignorant? Well, how about proving us wrong? For starters, get this straight: There were no weapons of mass destruction; the Iraqis did not attack the World Trade Center; lots of children (including many of yours) are left behind every day; the greenhouse effect is for real; and the Dixie Chicks were right. Pin down a few of those basics and then perhaps we'll talk.

Am I being elitist here? Disrespectful of the dignity of the masses? I fuckin' hope so, because 51 percent of the masses have had their say and it doesn't make sense. Besides, when I think about people being tortured while they're held without representation at Guantnamo and Iraqi families crawling out of the rubble of their own homes, I'm not too worried if I insult some Bible-sucking insurance salesman or a possum-breathed saw sharpener.

Too harsh? I know (because I've been so chided) that there are lots of good, right-thinking/left-leaning liberals out there who feel it's my responsibility to "understand" you. These are good people; unlike you assholes, they voted the right way. But this is why in true progressive circles the word liberal attracts adjectives such as "wishy-washy," "self-serving" and "useless."

In its own well-intentioned way, liberalism is, when you think about it, almost as big a problem as fundamentalism is. See, as much as I disagree with you and am disgusted by the shallow and pathetic pawns you've become, I respect your potential. That's why liberal Democrats can't bring themselves to do what the Republicans do so well -- cynically lie to you for selfish gain. (Do you really think Kerry would have banned the Bible?) We nice people actually expected reasoned arguments, logic and incontrovertible evidence to convince you that Kerry was the better candidate. Turns out that the GOP's double whammy of fear and loathing is a more powerful vote-getting tool.

Of course they, not we, laid the groundwork there. And that's the real shocker you fly-over chicken-rubbers are going to realize just before the end (of freedom, that is; I don't mean the Rapture, which is something else you believe in that's not going to happen): You've been duped, and the Bushies are laughing at you behind your spineless backs right now. The Republicans don't care about you; they just wanted your vote so they can stay in power and make their oil-and-blood-soaked cronies even richer. They're going to send your job overseas and destroy Social Security. In the name of catching terrorists, they're going to make sure you don't read any interesting books or travel without permission. They're going to toss you a minuscule tax cut in exchange for under-funding public education and social services, so there will be more poor people around to bother you. Perhaps you will become one of them.

They're going to shower the pharmaceutical companies with excess profits while denying you life-saving medical attention. They're going to let corporate conglomerates fill the air you breathe with carcinogens while they discourage clean-energy research. They're going to insist the ozone layer's OK until y'all bake your little red asses off. They're going to alienate the rest of the Western world and any portion of the Eastern world that isn't willing to supply Wal-Mart with cheap labor. They're going to throw more Saddam-esque bogeymen in your face while tacitly supporting Saudi terrorists and ignoring nuclear-armed Korean dictators. They're going to rig the system so that even you law-abiding yahoos won't be able to get a fair trial. And worst of all, they're going to dehumanize your children and send them off to kill or be killed in the name of oil profits.

And you bought into it all because you're afraid. And you're afraid because they scared you. And it was all so unnecessary. You don't have to be frightened. You (okay, most of you) aren't really stupid or helpless. I know you at your worst and best. I grew up with you; I shared outdoor plumbing with you; I complimented the dead deer hanging on your front porches. You can open your minds and accept or reject things on their merits instead of on their reputations in small-minded circles. You can think for yourselves.

And some day, you might figure that out. Meanwhile, you deserve what we all got thanks to you, you bastards.

Clif Garboden is senior managing editor of The Boston Phoenix and president of the Association of Alternative Newsweeklies. He can be reached at cgarboden@phx.com.

medic5
11-23-2004, 12:09 PM
He sounds like one of those brainless twits who paid to see that fat Communist piece of shit Michael Moore's movie 2 or 3 times. There's one thing to have your views, but another to condemn the other side for winning fairly. This election wasn't decided in the courts fortunately. It was decided by the people. Perhaps next time, if the crybaby Dem's feel so strongly about and against some official in particular, they'll care enough to get out and vote. Obviously, they can't take losing. If you hate it so much: move to Canada.

burning85
11-23-2004, 12:14 PM
and to think that ass took the time to actually write that like anyone was going to give a shit and say hey good job!!! get real!

xploded
11-23-2004, 12:26 PM
Everytime these "know-it-all" libs open their mouths, it shows their ignorance. They just do not get it. He is an idiot.

DrGreenbaumberg
11-23-2004, 08:26 PM
Good summation.

hog
11-23-2004, 09:50 PM
USA...........love it or leave it

DrGreenbaumberg
11-23-2004, 10:45 PM
USA...........love it or leave it

Nice & trite :)

Emtmom
11-24-2004, 07:48 AM
Is that what we blue staters think? Funny, looks like the ramblings of one man in desperate need of a shrink to me.

LT Mick
11-24-2004, 08:48 AM
USA...........love it or leave it
FUCK YOU ASSHOLE

BCFD in Philly
11-24-2004, 11:41 AM
What a fuckin' joke this guy is.



Screw you, America

Sometimes the fish in the barrel deserve to die

B Y C L I F G A R B O D E N

America speaks with one voice. Unfortunately, it emanates from its ass.
--Barry Crimmins
November 17, 2004

N E W S F E A T U R E


They're going to shower the pharmaceutical companies with excess profits while denying you life-saving medical attention.
Hopefully those companies will spend them on the R & D needed to develop a treatment and medication for C L I F's 100% terminal condition - an exagerrated sense of self-importance.


Am I being elitist here? Disrespectful of the dignity of the masses? I fuckin' hope so, because 51 percent of the masses have had their say and it doesn't make sense

Elitist? Of course not, the majority spoke, you don't like it, so it doesn't make sense. When would you like your coronation as king scheduled? How about right after your next Ritalin shot, so your address to the masses will be somewhat coherent.

Chia6004
11-24-2004, 03:03 PM
I agree with some but not all of what he said, Wal Mart is the devil incarnate I tell you. He could have picked a more tactful and diplomatic way to present his views however. For those that said he needs to leave that is very ignorant, you see we have this thing called freedom of speech in this country every one has the right to say anything they want. Even to say that Sadam has been SODOMIZING the middle east.

No matter how much of a Liberal I'am I admit that we lost this election all by ourselves, I still think that Herman Munster would've made a better pres then Curious George but hey.

I do not hate you red staters, Where the fuck did this come from anyway Blue states used to show where the incumbent had won while red states were where the challenger won, But I'am disturbed and worried as to the direction that the world in general is growing are economy if on the verge of collapse the trade defecit is horrid the housing market is about to crash, we may not be buying on margin now but this economy is very similar to the economy of the 20s.

A little article I found http://business.bostonherald.com/businessNews/view.bg?articleid=55356

Economic `Armageddon' predicted
By Brett Arends/ On State Street
Tuesday, November 23, 2004

Stephen Roach, the chief economist at investment banking giant Morgan Stanley, has a public reputation for being bearish.

But you should hear what he's saying in private.

Roach met select groups of fund managers downtown last week, including a group at Fidelity.

His prediction: America has no better than a 10 percent chance of avoiding economic ``armageddon.''

Press were not allowed into the meetings. But the Herald has obtained a copy of Roach's presentation. A stunned source who was at one meeting said, ``it struck me how extreme he was - much more, it seemed to me, than in public.''

Roach sees a 30 percent chance of a slump soon and a 60 percent chance that ``we'll muddle through for a while and delay the eventual armageddon.''

The chance we'll get through OK: one in 10. Maybe.

In a nutshell, Roach's argument is that America's record trade deficit means the dollar will keep falling. To keep foreigners buying T-bills and prevent a resulting rise in inflation, Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan will be forced to raise interest rates further and faster than he wants.

The result: U.S. consumers, who are in debt up to their eyeballs, will get pounded.

Less a case of ``Armageddon,'' maybe, than of a ``Perfect Storm.''

Roach marshalled alarming facts to support his argument.

To finance its current account deficit with the rest of the world, he said, America has to import $2.6 billion in cash. Every working day.

That is an amazing 80 percent of the entire world's net savings.

Sustainable? Hardly.

Meanwhile, he notes that household debt is at record levels.

Twenty years ago the total debt of U.S. households was equal to half the size of the economy.

Today the figure is 85 percent.

Nearly half of new mortgage borrowing is at flexible interest rates, leaving borrowers much more vulnerable to rate hikes.

Americans are already spending a record share of disposable income paying their interest bills. And interest rates haven't even risen much yet.

You don't have to ask a Wall Street economist to know this, of course. Watch people wielding their credit cards this Christmas.

Roach's analysis isn't entirely new. But recent events give it extra force.

The dollar is hitting fresh lows against currencies from the yen to the euro.

Its parachute failed to open over the weekend, when a meeting of the world's top finance ministers produced no promise of concerted intervention.

It has farther to fall, especially against Asian currencies, analysts agree.

The Fed chairman was drawn to warn on the dollar, and interest rates, on Friday.

Roach could not be reached for comment yesterday. A source who heard the presentation concluded that a ``spectacular wave of bankruptcies'' is possible.

Smart people downtown agree with much of the analysis. It is undeniable that America is living in a ``debt bubble'' of record proportions.

But they argue there may be an alternative scenario to Roach's. Greenspan might instead deliberately allow the dollar to slump and inflation to rise, whittling away at the value of today's consumer debts in real terms.

Inflation of 7 percent a year halves ``real'' values in a decade.

It may be the only way out of the trap.

Higher interest rates, or higher inflation: Either way, the biggest losers will be long-term lenders at fixed interest rates.

You wouldn't want to hold 30-year Treasuries, which today yield just 4.83 percent.

Time to start studying wilderness survival techniques.

hog
11-24-2004, 07:17 PM
FUCK YOU ASSHOLE
hey LT i fought for this country ....my brother ....my father etc....etc....etc....so FUCK you LOVE IT OR GET THE FUCK OUT

DrGreenbaumberg
11-24-2004, 09:21 PM
Yes indeed. Love it or leave it. Clearly, dissenting with the government or disliking a particular party's politics means that you hate America and should leave. This is the logic of champions.

BigGreasy
11-24-2004, 10:17 PM
When are these dumbass liberal assholes gonna realize it is this crap they keep talking that loses them elections.

No Fear
11-24-2004, 10:49 PM
Just when you thought you read it all, and here comes some asshole still crying the blues because Kerry lost. The sad part about it is there are assholes out there who believe this communists. Will you people get over it. I truly respect John Kerry for the way he conceded. It took alot of guts to admit defeat and wished the country as awhole to come together for a better and stronger America. He fought a good fight and I would hope that if Geo. Bush lost he would do the same thing. I for one, who served my country, exercise my right to vote. I don't need some poor bastard newpaper geek telling that I made a mistake for voting that day. Its assholes like this newspaper geek that make shock jocks look like altar boys. First he belittles Kerry then, you and me both for voting, obviously his man didn't win so we are all at fault for destroying America. The bastard probably didn't even serve his country , but has the brainless conclusions that the American Citizens are the devil in this past election. If you really want to know why John Kerry lost its bastards like this, movie stars, singers and the media. You don't have to be a genius to figure this out. And tho I probably going to get a nasty gram or vacation from the mods, I got to say one thing to Clif "Fuck You "

PS: Chia I'm glad California did something right for a change, Scott Peterson was found guilty. Who would have believe it.

Stay Safe, Have A Great Thanksgiving!

BCFD in Philly
11-25-2004, 12:59 AM
PS: Chia I'm glad California did something right for a change, Scott Peterson was found guilty. Who would have believe it.

Stay Safe, Have A Great Thanksgiving!

He was not found innocent because he is not a bonafide member of one of the victim groups who are not held personally responsible for things illegal or unlawful they do, due to being the victim of circumstances created by others.

Chia6004
11-25-2004, 01:36 AM
"PS: Chia I'm glad California did something right for a change, Scott Peterson was found guilty. Who would have believe it."

LOL, That worries me though, he probablly is guilty but all they ever proved was motive, no murder weapon, no cause of death, no dna evidence tying scott to lacy he was convicted purly on hear-say and conjecture. Very disturbing to me.

Everyone Enjoy your thanksgiving.

No Fear
11-25-2004, 03:15 AM
Chia, no need to be distrubed, its okay that you had an honest jury for a change out there. All the evidence against OJ and he still got off, nothing circumstantial there. But Peterson that whole case was based on circumstantial evidence and the scales tilted the right way for a change. So once again my friend the only thing distrubing is Clif not the justice system.

Emtmom
11-25-2004, 01:10 PM
Chia, no need to be distrubed, its okay that you had an honest jury for a change out there. All the evidence against OJ and he still got off, nothing circumstantial there. But Peterson that whole case was based on circumstantial evidence and the scales tilted the right way for a change. So once again my friend the only thing distrubing is Clif not the justice system.
It isn't over yet, he gets an automatic appeal, and it should worry EVERYONE that someone could be convicted with no evidence and a witness who saw Lacy walking her dog in the park AFTER they claim Scott killed her. The second witness who had seen her after the time line the police have was a woman in her 80's who passed away before the police could find the time to go back and interview her. It's very scary that anyone could be convicted with NO evidence!

No Fear
11-25-2004, 02:40 PM
It isn't over yet, he gets an automatic appeal, and it should worry EVERYONE that someone could be convicted with no evidence and a witness who saw Lacy walking her dog in the park AFTER they claim Scott killed her. The second witness who had seen her after the time line the police have was a woman in her 80's who passed away before the police could find the time to go back and interview her. It's very scary that anyone could be convicted with NO evidence!

I agree its not over yet, especially how screwed up California is regarding to Court decisions. However cicumstantial evidence is admissible in court, and I believe that the State has proven their case againts a murderer like Scott Peterson. If there was an issue regarding to Laci walking her dog why didn't the defense push that evidence hard, put her or him on the stand. Why didn't Scott Peterson take the stand, Don't you think that an innocent man would fight like hell to prove that he was innocent. Nope good ole Scott sat there like a fox caught in the hen house with feathers in his mouth. Lets examine the things that were brought out in the trial that was credible instead of the defense's insane bullshit.

1: Scott Peterson Fishing trip - A expert fisherman questioned why Peterson would be fishing that type of fish on that given date and time with that equipment. Proves Peterson doesn't or has liitle knowledge on fishing.

Plus how many people go fishing on Christmas Eve, not saying they don't but Peterson I'm a little puzzle with that.

2: Why change his appearance, have his brother identification,near the border with a large sum of money. Sounds like he was moving to Mexico, wonder why?

3: Cement in the boat, Tho I don't have alot of experience in boats, however I been on my share, why cement in the boat, especially since it was recently purchased. Sound like he was trying to weigh something down and hope it wouldn't come up.

4: Don't you think if your wife was missing that Peterson would be more mindful of his spouses disappearance then trying to bone Amber. I don't hear him say I love and miss my wife to her, did you?

5: Isn't it amazing that Laci and Conner was located the same area that Scott Peterson said he was fisihing.

6: Hairs found belonging to Laci. No further statement required.

I can go on and on, the jury has spoken and found Scott Peterson guilty of pre-mediated murder. Just like OJ should have, another topic that I'm sure will bring some response. The man show no signs of remorse , no signs of greiving (forgive me for the spelling) for the lost of a wife and son. I think God really knows who the killer is and I don't see no halo over Scott Peterson,

Emtmom
11-25-2004, 07:08 PM
1: Scott Peterson Fishing trip - A expert fisherman questioned why Peterson would be fishing that type of fish on that given date and time with that equipment. Proves Peterson doesn't or has liitle knowledge on fishing.

Why did the judge not allow the video tape that was made by a private investigator that proves with that type of boat he could not have dumped Laci's body without capsizing the boat?

2: Why change his appearance, have his brother identification,near the border with a large sum of money. Sounds like he was moving to Mexico, wonder why?beats me, his mother claims she gave him the money to pay his brother for a car......who knows!

3: Cement in the boat, Tho I don't have alot of experience in boats, however I been on my share, why cement in the boat, especially since it was recently purchased. Sound like he was trying to weigh something down and hope it wouldn't come up. Beats me, I wasn't there to hear the evidence. You do know that the hair they found in his truck turned out to belong to one of the cops. And what they thought was blood turned out not to be blood at all? the DNA tests proved that.

4: Don't you think if your wife was missing that Peterson would be more mindful of his spouses disappearance then trying to bone Amber. I don't hear him say I love and miss my wife to her, did you? Would that not be obvious? The man was cheating on her, it's obvious he didn't love Laci.

6: Hairs found belonging to Laci. No further statement required.As I said above they already proved through DNA that the hair found in the boat was that of one of the police officers. As the blood in his truck turned out through DNA tests to not even be blood!

I can go on and on, the jury has spoken and found Scott Peterson guilty of pre-mediated murder. Just like OJ should have, another topic that I'm sure will bring some response. The man show no signs of remorse , no signs of greiving (forgive me for the spelling) for the lost of a wife and son. I think God really knows who the killer is and I don't see no halo over Scott Peterson, maybe they did, but don't you find it odd that one day after a new juror was chosen and they are supposed to start deliberations over that within 3 hours they had decided? I'm sorry I find that very fishy!
I'm not saying he's innocent, but it is VERY scary to me that someone is convicted with no hard evidence.
How many of the convicts on death row have they now found through DNA were NOT GUILTY, but they were convicted on circumstancial evidence, that's scary!

No Fear
11-26-2004, 12:04 AM
I can understand some of your concerns in other cases, however I believe the state and the police did a good job on presenting their case and the defense came up with some unbelieveable theories, like they mention a cult, however Scott Peterson did not take the stand to defend himself and I find that pretty fishy also. Wouldn't you want to get on that stand and look each juror in the eye and demand that you are not the killer of your wife and unborn son. I certainly would. His dirty laundry was out anyway, why not go full bore on defending himself. I can understand the jury episode. The jury consists of twelve citizens with usually two or three alternates. The judge , just like in this case can excuse a juror who did not follow his/hers directions. The alternate then would take the excuse juror spot then. The alternate also hears all the evidence and testimony. As far as the private investigator. what was his expertise. To be an expert witness you must be qualified as such and after doing so you can offer an opinion. If you don't qualify then your lay witness which must have base your opinion on speculations or hearsay which is not admissible. Maybe he was found as a lay and not an expert. Also didn't the judge allow jurors to examine the boat to include climb in same. I think justice was served in this case, because as you point out some things are fishy and I think Scott Peterson did doing this investigation was pretty fishy also.

Its fun to debate ya and hope you had a great thanksgiving.

Emtmom
11-26-2004, 03:33 PM
I can understand some of your concerns in other cases, however I believe the state and the police did a good job on presenting their case and the defense came up with some unbelieveable theories, like they mention a cult, however Scott Peterson did not take the stand to defend himself and I find that pretty fishy also. Wouldn't you want to get on that stand and look each juror in the eye and demand that you are not the killer of your wife and unborn son. I certainly would. His dirty laundry was out anyway, why not go full bore on defending himself. I can understand the jury episode. The jury consists of twelve citizens with usually two or three alternates. The judge , just like in this case can excuse a juror who did not follow his/hers directions. The alternate then would take the excuse juror spot then. The alternate also hears all the evidence and testimony. As far as the private investigator. what was his expertise. To be an expert witness you must be qualified as such and after doing so you can offer an opinion. If you don't qualify then your lay witness which must have base your opinion on speculations or hearsay which is not admissible. Maybe he was found as a lay and not an expert. Also didn't the judge allow jurors to examine the boat to include climb in same. I think justice was served in this case, because as you point out some things are fishy and I think Scott Peterson did doing this investigation was pretty fishy also.

Its fun to debate ya and hope you had a great thanksgiving. I don't wanna drag the whole thing out again, let me just say this: You may want to get on the stand and defend yourself, but there isn't a SMART defense lawyer anywhere that is going to let you take that chance! If you get on the stand, then the prosecution has the right to cross exam you, your lawyer is NEVER going to let the prosecution get that kind of shot at you. It is for your own protection.
As for the video tape of the private investigator had, according to him, he and his partner were arguing over wether or not a boy could be dumped by one person from such a shallow boat. So they went and reinacted it, and the boat either capsized or he fell out of the boat when he tried t dump the body. He wasn't paid by anyone to do the reinactment. He was interviewed on the news, and that's what he told the reporter.
Like I said he may very well be guilty, but they should have concrete evidence. They should have something to prove it, not hear say and circumstancial.
Should OJ have been found guilty...OH HELL YES! lol The gloves didn't fit...ROFL.... of course not they were leather and wet...ie....THEY SHRANK! lol

Thanks, I love a good debate too! Hope you had a nice Thanksgiving also!

No Fear
11-26-2004, 04:31 PM
Now all thats settle back back to the post, whats that asshole name, thats right Clif

Jon
12-01-2004, 04:22 PM
So, to put it aptly, go fuck yourselves and leave other people alone.
If the "Blue Staters" feel so strongly this way, why can't they act this way toward others? So what if I want to have a house full of guns and bibles, make my own way without the government's help or hinderance, and teach my children what I believe to be right and wrong? Maybe he should follow his own mantra and leave me alone. The truth is these people preach tolerance of their own ideals and lifestyles but supreme intolerance of others'.

paranurse
12-03-2004, 11:37 PM
Here's what I don't get. I'm really glad W. won, I think we're all a little safer, and the country will be better off for it. In a time, however, when America is in a nasty war with no clear end, the ecomony is still day to day, and we're still a big target for whoever wishes us ill, how is Jim and Steve getting married the issue that has everyone juiced? I'm not a big fan of screwing with societies institutions, nor am I, for that matter, against letting individuals love who they will.

There is just something not altogether right here. I think social conservatism has its place, but as someone who basically wants the government to defend my shores and get me my mail on time - and then stay out of my life, I'm a little worried.

Like I said, I'm glad W. won, but the cost concerns me. At least now I know
how Pyhrrus felt.

DrGreenbaumberg
12-07-2004, 06:03 PM
If the "Blue Staters" feel so strongly this way, why can't they act this way toward others? So what if I want to have a house full of guns and bibles, make my own way without the government's help or hinderance, and teach my children what I believe to be right and wrong? Maybe he should follow his own mantra and leave me alone. The truth is these people preach tolerance of their own ideals and lifestyles but supreme intolerance of others'.


Hahaha. Yes, we "bluestaters" want to ban bibles from your homes. We're out to get you AND your guns AND teach your children to be gay. Look out.

Axesr4choppin
12-10-2004, 01:35 AM
Scott Peterhead killed his wife. Period. Just because there is no muder weapon, dna, etc., there is good old fashioned POLICE WORK! You Liberals need to get a grip and go figure... there were murder convictions BEFORE dna and bleeding heart juries. FRY SCOTT FRY!!

Emtmom
12-10-2004, 08:11 AM
FRY SCOTT FRY!!YES, I believe in the death penalty, but theres this little part of me, that thinks you should let people like that sit in jail for a good long time. Let them live with what they did, let that little demon eat away at them for a while, let them suffer, like they have made others suffer.

burning85
12-10-2004, 11:43 AM
sometimes....morbid or not...i feel it would speak volumes to criminals if a convicted criminal be killed the way whomever they murdered was killed!...but then again with some of the problems in our judicial system, errors could be made with killing the wrong person and all! so then the point would just be diminished.

BCFD in Philly
12-10-2004, 09:25 PM
YES, I believe in the death penalty, but theres this little part of me, that thinks you should let people like that sit in jail for a good long time. Let them live with what they did, let that little demon eat away at them for a while, let them suffer, like they have made others suffer.

Naw, then we would here about new evidence (like the Colombian Drug ring that killed Nicole Brown Simpson), what Scott is eating for breakfast, how he is helping other prisoners, the book deal and Oprah suing for an in-prison interview. No Thanks, just erase him. We don't hear anything about McVeigh and nothing about Gilmore (with the candle light in Utah). They have a new place where they can plead their case and the judge can't be overruled!

Jon
12-19-2004, 02:12 PM
Hahaha. Yes, we "bluestaters" want to ban bibles from your homes. We're out to get you AND your guns AND teach your children to be gay. Look out.Umm..OK, I guess you meant that sarcastically, but the truth is the general trend in this country is to eliminate Christianity and individual liberty. "Will and Grace" makes me want to vomit, so I don't watch it. I don't cry to the network, wave signs, etc, because I recognize some people think it's funny and they have the right to watch whatever they want. Would you do the same if there was a prime-time sitcom about a family of white supremacists and their zany adventures fighting the crazy Negroes and Jews?
The truth about the guns is they ARE out to get them. John Kery voted in the Senate only three times during his campaign, and all three were gun-ban bills. One would have banned civilian ownership of any weapon that had ever been procured for government, police, or military use. Gone would be the Remington 700 rifle and 870 shotgun (both classic hunting firearms), just about all handguns, and even the Remington 11-87 shotgun Kerry himself posed with at a canned pheasant hunt in Ohio during his campaign. Maryland, my home state (yes, I am geographically located in a blue state), passed into law a requirement that all handguns include a technology that did not exist, the integral trigger lock. I know New York City has some of the most restrictive firearm ownership laws in the nation, arguably second only to DC. I haven't checked numbers, but the murder rates surely must be really low there. The rural county I live in has an almost 100% gun ownership rate, and we just had our first murder of 2004- a stabbing.
How many times have you heard the word "Christmas" on TV this year? It's been essentially replaced by "Holiday"- "Holiday lights", "Holiday trees", "Holiday dinners", "Children's Holiday Program", etc. I've even heard "Chrismukka", which should offend both Jews and Christians as it debases both holidays into a season rather than a celebration of miraculous events. Nobody stops people from celebrating Hanukkah, Kwanzaa, the Winter Solstice, or whatever it is they would like to celebrate, so why can't Christians celebrate Christmas?
I stand by my statement that Liberals are militant about the tolerance of their beliefs and lifestyles but refuse to tolerate those of others.

burning85
12-19-2004, 03:30 PM
Oustandingly well put!!!!!!!!
p.s. Merry Christmas!!

LT Mick
12-21-2004, 09:59 AM
Well Good Ole' Gw has done it again. One month after his relection and now his approval rating is down below 50%.

First time in history that a newly re-elected President had such a POOR approval rating right after election.

Apparently FINALLY some bullheaded, blind, gullable SO & SOs have finally seen him for the lying dumb S&^t that he is. Too abd they did not see it 6 weeks ago. Now we are stuck with the SOB for another 4 years of lying, and eroding civil rights (USA Patriot Act) from this dumbass Good Ole Boy.

The man is dumber than a box of rocks. his VP is as crooked as an appalachian mountain road.

Tim P. McMenamin
An honest bleeding heart proud liberal died in the wool DEMOCRAT!

BCFD in Philly
12-21-2004, 11:48 AM
Well Good Ole' Gw has done it again. One month after his relection and now his approval rating is down below 50%.

First time in history that a newly re-elected President had such a POOR approval rating right after election.

Apparently FINALLY some bullheaded, blind, gullable SO & SOs have finally seen him for the lying dumb S&^t that he is. Too abd they did not see it 6 weeks ago. Now we are stuck with the SOB for another 4 years of lying, and eroding civil rights (USA Patriot Act) from this dumbass Good Ole Boy.

The man is dumber than a box of rocks. his VP is as crooked as an appalachian mountain road.

Tim P. McMenamin
An honest bleeding heart proud liberal died in the wool DEMOCRAT!

How does the saying (sort of) go... People in glass houses shouldn't throw rocks....How many rocks do you have in your box? Died in the wool? How about dyed? Then again.....

LT Mick
12-21-2004, 12:48 PM
OK you are right!
One typo, still doesn't change the facts

BCFD in Philly
12-21-2004, 01:17 PM
OK you are right!
One typo, still doesn't change the facts

and multiple typos don't validate your opinions.

Jon
12-23-2004, 01:26 AM
This is pretty interesting. It's a county-by-county red/blue map.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/politicselections/vote2004/countymap.htm

Jon
12-23-2004, 02:10 AM
Oh, boy, I went and offended somebody. I'm not sure which tirade that people should be nice to each other did it, but it was probably the thing about the TV show. Here's the scoop. I have no idea what type of entertainment the gentleman to whom I responded watches and doesn't watch. To illustrate the point, I picked a plot line that any reasonable person would surely object to, with the idea that anyone would not object to it being so absurd as to be humorous. (If you need it dumbed down, that means it's so stupid it's funny.) It's called satire. The person who was so offended by my writing knows the name of my boss and is going to march down to his office tomorrow morning and and express his/her displeasure. Or so it said in the private nastygram I got. This person has not posted on this thread. Here's a copy of my reply to the private message.

Mr. or Ms. ---------,
First of all, the disclaimer "Warning! The discussion in this area are not be entered into by sensitive people. If you are easily offended skip this section." appears on The Watch Desk's main page, right under the link you clicked to reach this section.
Second, my posts to this thread have been about tolerance (for it) and include many references to my respect for the freedom of expression and religion of others. I would request you respect mine as well.
I have removed my name and company affiliations from my signature. They were listed because I saw no need to hide my identity. However, now I see a need to protect myself from people on this forum who hide behind a shield of anonymity and make threats to another person's livelihood.

DaGonz
12-26-2004, 01:46 PM
Hey..this is my first post on TWD...be gentle....

The original story posted in this thread was from the Boston Phoenix. They are a trashy free newspaper which primarily gets its revenues from the sales of some rather "questionable" ads for escort services and an extensive "personal" ad section. Whatever your perversion is, you would find it there.

The owner of the paper is a ultra liberal millionaire, married to one of the most left wing judges in the state court system. The courts do work, though...she was fined a rather hefty amount for supplying alcohol to a high school party hosted by her son while she and hubby were on vacation (of course, she claimed no knowldege , but the credit card recipts stated otherwise!)

SouthsideLadderMan
12-27-2004, 10:15 AM
Welcome to The Watch Desk Captain!

TM25

DrGreenbaumberg
12-27-2004, 01:01 PM
Jon...I'm sorry you didn't get to celebrate Christmas.